Move to Iceland

Change your organization!

I feel for you - I’m dealing with the same sort of mentality, except from the Java camp.

I wouldn’t be so frustrated if they would at least evaluate it.

Oh well - someday we will rule the world!

I’m got a small personal project that is about to launch (http://www.areyouhiring.com), and hope that it might help break me out.

Damn, and here I thought I found someone who agrees with me. Granted, anything is better than asp.net, but I hate rails. Truly.

I find the syntax horrible, the lack of good documentation ( and I don’t mean scouring the API. Yes, a published API is needed, but not to learn by, thank you ) , the limitations ( overriding everything that is supposed to make it good to overcome them is not an answer, try again ), the “rules” you must follow, the half-dozen SQL queries it makes for simple things, and most of all, getting non-trivial one table web apps to work is agony. Yes, agony.

I have programmed in java, C#, PHP, and Perl and by no means a master in any of them, I could get something, anything at all to work in less than one day. Rails? I spent two weeks trying to get a 7 table, simple app with just one, 1-N relationship and could not get it to function properly. I read the Agile book. I posted to ruby-forum.com ( plenty of replies, but no one could provide an answer. I guess it’s not as easy as claimed if no one could solve my simple request?).

I honestly am not trolling here. I’m trying to find out why people rave about it. Looping over a hash and it only returns the first pair? WTF? myhash.inspect shows 10 sets! Why doesn’t the iterator work!!? Trying to update a 1-N? More strange errors than I could count… I could go on, but you get the point. I’ve never encountered so much difficulty with something that is supposedly “simple”. Abstract? Sure. Simple? Ah, no. Things break in bizarre ways and you have nowhere to turn.

The rails site says “web development without the pain”. I sincerely beg to differ.

Java is not just for Web Development.

if you all you want is dynamic web site scripting go PHP, Python.

Java shines when we are dealing with N-Tier Architecture, Distributed Objects, Distributed Transactions, Security, Messaging(MOM). when High Availability,Fail Over, Load Balancing are important. where we need to talk to Legacy systems using JCA and talk to highly scalabale CORBA/C++ apps over IIOP.

i really wonder how any of those can be done in lame ruby.

JSP/Servlet and MVC frameworks are just part of the very big picture that was described earlier.

this is serious development, and needs serious and dedicated engineers.

for the rest of script kiddies who have no brain to understand highly scalable and complex systems, and just want to do a crappy dynamic website and think theyre cool , let them have it.

they are just script kiddies, let them play.

if you are scripting with PHP,Perl,Python, VB you may look into it. Java and specifically Enterprise Java do not level with these scripting Toolz.

just looking at ruby syntax makes me wanna puke. urrrghhhhhh.

Jason, RoR is not meant to replace Java. It’s meant to augment the tools that programmers have at their disposal. Obviously, you “have no brain” or you’d be able to pick up both languages and add it to your toolbelt.

And to address your assertion that only “script kiddies” use interpreted languages, here’s the site of a very heavy user of python: http://www.google.com.

Retard.

I’m with you . After 9 months of suffering with trying to get a good RoR site working for my employer, I gave up, grabbed asp.net, and had the project done in 3 weeks. OK, so I’m more familiar with microsoft products, but RoR drove me a little bit mad. I understand there are pros and cons to all environments, but my two cents work with RoR errrch

Editor: I’m not sure if you read the post. The reason I hate RoR is because I love it too much. It’s torture being away from it. And to make matters worse, I’ve gone from ASP.NET/C# and LAMP to Java. And with a baby on the way I don’t have any time to fiddle with RoR.

I have been using ROR for a few months and it is the worst language I have used to date.

I thought it was supposed to up development time.

Instead 5 months later we are struggling on simple things that could easly be implemented through a high level development tool for JSP / JSF

We have switched and have noticed a much better and faster development cycle.

I personally do not recommend ROR. It looks like only the books do.

I have now finished 3 projects in PHP while the others are still trying to get the first ROR project to work.

Simple things that are accomplished in PHP and JSP take too long and are most frustrating using the syntax.

I dislike having wasted 6 months on it and do not recommend it to anyone.

I agree with Jason.

ROR code makes me want to puke.

I hate it.

I use Java for enterprise development.

We wasted over half a year trying to get the Ruby on Rails to work.

Its a mess and I personally hate it.

Rails has made me hate web development!

I wonder what OS the RoR haters are using. I’m trying to learn RoR using a Win machine and am finding it a farkin’ nightmare. One thing after the other doesn’t work. I thought it was supposed to be beautiful and elegant, but it’s ugly as all hell.

The scary part is that I’m using Basecamp to manage my Rails project with a friend and Basecamp (a Rails app) has got problems that look Rails farkin’ up the SQL, e.g. output not properly grouped resulting in duplicate output.

Anyway, those 37 Signals folks are some serious spin doctors. I hope all the hype wasn’t just from their marketing prowess. I’d hate to have wasted all this time.

MTI, what do you like about Rails?

I have very mixed feelings about Rails. Sure, it is very speedy, can be very efficient, yadda yadda yadda. Maybe its my lack of experience with the language, but I do find that doing some chores takes me the longest time.

Also there are the caveats and gotchas that I hate. I created a rather simple CRUD application using AjaxScaffold and got it working in virtually no time. Then came adding security here and there and the whole thing got a bit tedious, but still doable. Couple of months after deployment I get a call from the customer, saying the application isn’t even booting up. WTF? I check the logs and keep getting some obscure error. After searching high and low for a cure, I find out that my gems updated themselves and broke the application. Solution is fairly easy and I learn about freezing applications. And I know that if I had put some settings here and there, it would have been avoided. But still, WTF? The application gets all crappy because these guys cannot make components backward compatible?

And even further, the logs kept showing some warning messages: this and that feature should not be used and will be removed from the next version (i.e. either freeze the application NOW or your application will surely DIE).

I love the whole gem thing, installing from the command line and getting to work without having to browse thru a million jar files, and I love the simplicity of the language itself. Still, I believe that it is not ready for just about everything, not yet anyways. CRUD applications are so freaking easy to make with Rails as are so many other type of applications but I just don’t see it replacing any of the big guns for big projects, not yet anyway.

Most of the hype behind Rails is just people coming from languages such as Java and VB that hate the cumbersome nature of those languages’ syntax and the complexity to build even the most simple things. But I will take complex and stable/scalable with a bit longer development time over simple yet unstable/moody any day of the week.

I hate it. I hate it and I hate it’s face!

I have very limited experience, but it makes me sick to my stomach. It melted my brain having to use SSH!

I dealt with the beginnings, the the whole darn process ahead was frightening me. Working on it for 1.5 hrs drained me of all my energy, yet left me wired and crying for mommy. I have to keep running Linux commands the whole time? What? One site said THAT is “railsy”. Ugh.

Maybe I got the wrong impression, but there isn’t ANY info for ACTUAL newbies. I want ROR For Dummies, people.

I’m just a WordPress user, fairly new at PHP, but I kept reading about how great this thing was. They made it sound EASY!

It is 100% for computer geeks so computer geeky they should have government intelligence blasted into their genius brains. (I love Chuck. :-))

I hate it, an I hate its self-important face!

Oh the link here is only hosted, not a script, because I wanted my WP-related blog posts to be IN the wp community. I DO code my own websites.

My THING is doing it all with WP and plugins. My domain for it isn’t ready yet (neither is that blog).

Oh and I hate how the “anti” post was fictitious. Ugh. Self-important poo, it is.

I come from a C#/ASP.NET, classic ASP, and Java/JSP background. I literally want to delete ruby on rails. I hate it with an unimaginable passion. It is unbelievably awful. After reading the comments from most of the people that have replied to the original lame blog entry I feel much better though. Honestly, I thought there was something wrong with me; I have a Ruby book, and two Rails books, and development is so slow and so difficult I really thought I must be doing something wrong. Sure the examples in the agile book are great, and easy, but the moment, and I meant THE MOMENT, that you try to do something outside of those examples everything turns to crap. RoR makes it damn near impossible to implement the simplest of things. Not to beat a dead horse here, but like everyone else has said, where the heck is the documentation. Need something that’s not in the book, GOOD LUCK. You either have to figure it out yourself, or wait weeks in a forum (because nobody uses RoR) for someone that has struggled with the same problem that you are having to tell you that to fix the problem he switched to PHP, JSP, or ASP.NET. I HATE RUBY ON RAILS. PEACE OUT.

I think your a fucking moron.

Paul that is.

I read a tutorial on Rails which was on ONLAMP.com and saw couple video tutorials on you tube. The features and everything the technology promises is great. I tried to download/install/configure and get going and then i realized there is no proper documentation and they keep on breaking the existing stuff !! so the tutorials dont work !! the did that with dynamic scaffolding , it ticked me off , why would you wanna change things are done and break existing ways ?? I just cant understand that !! It occurs to me that the Ruby Developers are very sharp, intelligent and perfectioniust developers but they suck at how they can keep it more workable and promote it !! I guess its certainly not the way to go !! They cud have done a lot better with the ideas they started with !!